Is Believing a Work?

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KNO3		#21	[-]
Posts: 196 (12/22/2008 19:19:29) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	BrianT wrote: "You've never provided any evidence that someone loses their salvation, Brian. You post a bunch of verses and assume the conclusion." Whatever. "You read the question, "Can faith save him?" and you answer,"No." " If the answer was "Yes", the rest of the chapter would not make sense. If the answer is No, then the chapter doesn't make sense, because you would claim that Rahab was saved by LYING to the king's messengers.
BrianT		#22	[-]
Posts: 1647 (12/22/2008 19:23:38) ezOP Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Disagree with James 2:25 if you want, I care not. Brian
KNO3		#23	[-]
Posts: 199 (12/22/2008 19:29:06) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	BrianT wrote: Disagree with James 2:25 if you want, I care not. She had the glory, not God. You've got the fruit mixed up with the root, Brian. "For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath [whereof] to glory; but not before God. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works (Romans 4:2-6)," Your idea of salvation is not reckoned of grace, but of debt, pal.
BrianT		#24	[-]
Posts: 1651 (12/22/2008 19:35:51) ezOP Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	The problem is that you are opposing Paul and James, and choosing Paul. They do not oppose, they harmonize, and I choose both. Brian
HoLogos	What's the difference?	#25	[-]
Posts: 1092 (12/22/2008 22:49:41) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	I don't see what the difference is between earning salvation by works, and keeping salvation by works. What is the difference?
77		#26	[-]
Posts: 89 (12/23/2008 02:24:32) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	HoLogos wrote: I don't see what the difference is between earning salvation by works, and keeping salvation by works. What is the difference? To be able to earn salvation by works negates the point of Jesus's death and resurrection. To keep salvation by works simply means that one is free, under Christ, to commit good works with reckless abandon; or, precisely, for the glory of God. In short, works is evidence of a saving grace. "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." Groucho Marx
SAWBONES		#27	[-]
Posts: 14 (12/23/2008 07:28:59) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	It seems appropriate to note that "believing", as it relates to matters of Christian faith, is a response to revelation, not a "work".
BrianT		#28	[-]
Posts: 1656 (12/23/2008 08:01:44) ezOP Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	"I don't see what the difference is between earning salvation by works, and keeping salvation by works. What is the difference?" We are in the New Covenant. We cannot earn salvation, works or not - it is only by the gift of grace, through faith in Christ. Keeping salvation (remaining in the covenant) isn't really by works and/or faith either, it is also by grace as long as the conditions of the covenant are still in place. Grace is through faith. Works alone is worthless, and faith alone is dead. Works done in faith (or put another way, faith that works) is true faith that God's grace is through. I think it was C.S. Lewis that said something like "Debating faith and works is like asking which blade in a pair of scissors is the important one." Brian
77		#29	[-]
Posts: 94 (12/23/2008 23:55:28) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	BrianT wrote: "I don't see what the difference is between earning salvation by works, and keeping salvation by works. What is the difference?" We are in the New Covenant. We cannot earn salvation, works or not - it is only by the gift of grace, through faith in Christ. Keeping salvation (remaining in the covenant) isn't really by works and/or faith either, it is also by grace as long as the conditions of the covenant are still in place. Grace is through faith. Works alone is worthless, and faith alone is dead. Works done in faith (or put another way, faith that works) is true faith that God's grace is through. I think it was C.S. Lewis that said something like "Debating faith and works is like asking which blade in a pair of scissors is the important one." That reminds me - one of these days I am going to get to work on a compilation of C.S. Lewis zingers. "Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." Groucho Marx
AlFin		#30	[-]
Posts: 46 (12/26/2008 12:12:35) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	BrianT wrote: That garbage is easy enough to debunk; if eternal life is the end result, we don't have eternal life. Eternal life is granted in the present, not the future. It is both. We have eternal life now while we abide in him, but we also look for it to be granted in the future (Matt 25:44-46, Mark 10:30, Rom 2:6-7, Rom 6:22, Gal 6:8, 1 Tim 6:16-18, Titus 1:2, Jude 1:21). Brian, I know this is a little off subject, but from what I've heard, the phrase "eternal life" can have two meanings: 1) Life as God has it, or to put it another way, a quality of life, not a duration; and 2) As meaning duration, never ending life, the same as "everlasting life." The problem with either phrase meaning a duration of life is that even Satan and his angels, and humans spirits who don't pass the final judgement, do not die. So everyone lives forever. The difference is where they spend their eternity. This difference may impact the discussion. Allen

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