Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (logos1560) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 08:20:18 GMT

One of the reported changes according to Thomas Hill's 1648 sermon involved 1 Corinthians 12:28. "Helpers, governours" was the rendering of Tyndale's, Coverdale's, Matthew's, Great, Whittingham's, Geneva, and Bishops' Bibles at this verse. The 1557 Whittingham's and 1560 Geneva Bible have a marginal note for helpers: "As Deacons" and a marginal note for governors: "As...

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (logos1560) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 08:16:43 GMT

SAWBONES wrote:
I just don't believe we have as much evidence as is desirable, and I wish there were more certain documentation as to what the fourteen changes were, and what the original renderings were before Bancroft's alterations.

I am still looking for more, and I have been finding more. I just found the information about the 1652-1653 State Papers and the 1727 comments by...

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (SAWBONES) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 07:38:42 GMT

Boy, you type fast!

I have no bone to pick over this question. I just don't believe we have as much evidence as is desirable, and I wish there were more certain documentation as to what the fourteen changes were, and what the original renderings were before Bancroft's alterations.

The KJVOers maintain either that the original AV1611 is perfect or that one of the subsequent editions, up to and...

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (logos1560) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 07:00:53 GMT

Gustavus Paine maintained that Miles Smith, final editor of the KJV with Thomas Bilson, "protested that after Bilson and he had finished their editing, Bishop Bancroft made fourteen more changes." He gave as an example Bancroft's insistence on using "the glorious word bishopric even for Judas in Acts 1:20" (Men Behind the KJV, p. 128). Paine added: "The fact that Smith was the one to protest Bancroft's...

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (logos1560) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 06:56:39 GMT

SAWBONES wrote:
no other direct record exists.

Another KJV translator is also said to have maintained that changes were made, which would seem to support the claim that the 14 alterations were "against the minds of the translators." Charles Butterworth wrote: "Dr. Bret [Richard Brett, a KJV translator] reported that the Bps [bishops] altered very many places that...

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (logos1560) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 06:49:34 GMT

SAWBONES wrote:

As Benson Bobrick states in his very readable account Wide as the Waters, "the other thirteen changes are unknown" .

It is the same 1600's sources such as Thomas Hill's sermon and the 1671 book about Henry Jessey that refers to an unprinted manuscript made by Henry Jessey that mentions that it was KJV translator Miles...

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (SAWBONES) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 06:03:52 GMT

Many sources dealing with the history of the English Bible, specifically including the KJV Bible, refer to "these fourteen places" where changes were introduced by Richard Bancroft alone, after the translation had been considered already complete, at Stationers Hall, after Bilson and Smith had completed the final touches of page and chapter headings.
As far as I have been able to learn, references to exactly what these changes were are conjectural in all but one case...

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (logos1560) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 05:06:19 GMT

One place where the Church of England translators reveal their bias for their Episcopal church government is in Acts 14:23 where either the KJV translators, Bancroft, or another prelate omitted the words "by election" found in Tyndale's New Testament, Coverdale's Bible, Matthew's Bible, Great Bible, Taverner's Bible, Geneva Bible, and Bishops' Bible ("ordained them elders by election"). Dexter noted:...

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (logos1560) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 04:54:30 GMT

Armchair Scholar wrote:
Are those "fourteen places" revealed by anyone?

I have not yet found a list of all fourteen. In his 1648 sermon, Thomas Hill mentions five or six. A 1671 book about the Life of Henry Jessey [a Baptist] mentions some of them.

I am now aware of at least 4 1600's sources that mention them: the 1648 sermon by Thomas Hill, the 1652-1653 State Papers, the 1657 preamble...

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (amarillo) — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 02:18:48 GMT

where are the KJBO revisionist historians when we need them, huh?

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (gconan) — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 18:37:43 GMT

It is starting to be clear to me, that when the KJV copies William Tyndale it is very good. When it does not the change does not seem so good.

Re: Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (Armchair Scholar) — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 18:21:39 GMT

Are those "fourteen places" revealed by anyone? That would be quite interesting.

Was KJV corrupted by prelates? 1652 State Papers

feeds@yuku.com (logos1560) — Wed, 01 Jul 2009 17:11:37 GMT

The Calender of State Papers, Domestic Series, 1652-1653 as edited by Mary Green noted: "Statement that Dr. Hill declared in his sermon, and has since published, that when the Bible had been translated by the translators appointed, the New Testament was looked over by some prelates he could name, to bring it to speak prelatical language, and that he was informed by a great observer, that in 14...