Are You Naked?

Anything Goes Archive
Warrior of the Sword
Registered User
Joined: 01 May 2001, 03:50

28 Sep 2001, 19:28 #1

True Believers of today (not those who call themselves
"christians" but really are not, but rather, true
Believers in the Blood Atonement of Jesus Christ) do
not have convictions like our forefathers in the faith
of old. Why is that? There are at least four reasons I
can think of here:
1. They know very little, if anything, about the
Bible, Bible Standards, and Holy Living.
God put it this way in Hosea 4:6 "My people are
destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast
rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou
shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten
the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children."

2. They do not properly interpret the Bible. They
refuse to take what the Lord means literally about
living right and obeying God.
3. They have developed incorrect philosophies.
Philosophies like "psychology", "do your own thing",
"be your own person", "you are all right, no matter
what God thinks". This kind of thinking is properly
summed up in:
Judg. 17:6: "In those days there was no king in
Israel, but every man did that which was right in his
own eyes."

4. They listen to the wrong teachers instead of the
Word of God.
For example; one morning on one of the Radio Bible
Class panel discussion programs, they said that they
had already discussed cults and now were going to
discuss "dangerous religious groups." "These," they
said, "are not cults. They may have correct doctrine
in essential areas, but they are dangerous." When
asked to be more specific, one panel member pointed
out that these dangerous groups often require lady
members to wear only skirts and dresses, and they
often limit members to the use of one version of the
Bible.
What a ridiculous statement! Just as Israel was called
to be separate from the heathen nations around them,
so are we! Remember, Jesus said we are to be IN this
world, not OF this world!.
All Believers have standards. Some have high
standards, others have low standards, but all have
standards. Let's define some well-known words.
Conviction - a truth believed in the heart that is
Bible-based. It convicts you, not you, it. It is as
firm as the Word of God, for it is what the Bible
says.
Preference - a strong belief with no actual Bible
ground to stand on.
Standard - the line you draw within a conviction.
Personal conviction - there is no such thing. If it is
a conviction, it is in the Bible. If it is not
Bible-backed, it is not a conviction, it is a
preference, or an opinion!
Preaching, teaching, and the having of standards, is
not being legalistic. Legalism is something different.
There are three attitudes in Scripture that result in
legalism.
1. When someone wants you to keep a rule or system of
rules simply to glorify himself or the flesh, that is
legalism.
2. When we equate keeping a set of rules or laws with
salvation, that is legalism.
3. When we attempt to follow a set of rules or
standards in order to score points with God, that is
legalism.
So, having standards and convictions is NOT legalism
in any form.
Too much pressure from your friends indicates a need
to find new friends. A real friend will never ask you
to compromise in any way.
A desire for independence from a set of standards or
rules indicates the presence of a spirit of
lawlessness. That pretty much sums up our society.

Our lifestyles and our standards should reflect three
things:
Our love for the Lord.
His love for us.
Our love for others.

In this sermon, we are going to see what the Bible
says about modesty. This past summer has revealed to
us that we live in a pretty permissive society that is
getting more and more permissive all the time. Today,
in the name of Jesus, anything goes. Believe it or
not, there is even a "Christian Nudist Colony" located
here in the United States. This is incomprehensible!
It is also heathen and hedonistic. Does the Bible have
anything to say about modest clothing?
"In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in
modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not
with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly
array; But (which becometh women professing godliness)
with good works."
(1 Timothy 2:9-10)
One teenager asked in a Bible class,"If shorts are
immodest apparel for women, why aren't they considered
immodest for men?"
A good question that deserved a Biblical answer.
The Greek definitions of "modest apparel" will help us
to understand just what modest apparel is.
Modest = kosmois; a word related to kosmos meaning the
world order or world system. Kosmois means orderly,
well-arranged, decent, modest, and harmonious
arrangement.
Apparel = katastole; long-robed, to be let down in
order to cover. It also means not revealing, not
formfitting.
So, kosmois katastole, or modest apparel, means
well-arranged, harmoniously matched clothing that is
long enough and decent enough to cover that which
ought to be covered.

Something else ought to mentioned here. Kosmois means
harmonious. Your clothing ought to be in harmony with
the Christ that lives within you! If not, your life is
out of tune. Does your clothing need a tuneup?
If our clothing ought to be long enough to cover, what
is our clothing supposed to be long enough to cover?
How long does it have to be? This is answered in
Scripture. Our clothing has to be long enough to cover
what God calls our "nakedness." God's definition is
different than ours. Let's take a look at some verses
here.
"And thou shalt make them linen breeches to cover
their nakedness; from the loins even unto the thighs
they shall reach."
(Exodus 28-42)
This was so that when the priest walked up the stairs,
his nakedness would be hidden from the eyes of those
who were lower than him.
"Come down, and sit in the dust, O virgin daughter of
Babylon, sit on the ground: there is no throne, O
daughter of the Chaldeans:for thou shalt no more be
called tender and delicate. Take the millstones, and
grind meal: uncover thy locks, make bare the leg,
uncover the thigh, pass over the rivers."
(Isaiah
47:1-2 )
"So shall the king of Assyria lead away the Egyptians
prisoners, and the Ethiopians captives, young and old,
naked and barefoot, even with their buttocks
uncovered, to the shame of Egypt."
(Isaiah 20:4)
"Therefore that disciple whom Jesus loved saith unto
Peter, It is the Lord. Now when Simon Peter heard that
it was the Lord, he girt his fisher's coat unto him,
(for he was naked,) and did cast himself into the
sea."
(John 21:7)
I struggled with this one for a long time. I don't
like it any more than you do, but then again, God did
not ask me what I thought when He wrote this.
Nakedness was immoral, and God's moral law has never
changed!

This is the Biblical reasoning behind why it is
immoral...
For men and boys to wear shorts that come above the
knee.
For women and girls to wear dresses, skirts, and
culottes that come above the knee.
Ladies and gentlemen, this Bible standard leaves no
room for short wearing, miniskirts, athletic shorts,
or even basketball uniforms with shorts that come
above the knee. It also leaves absolutely no room for
mixed swimming.

God says that nakedness is more than total nudity. It
is the revealing of certain parts of the body that God
says are off-limits to others.
By the way, God is not
against mixed swimming as much as He is against mixed
nudity!
A lady who was the church secretary in a church was
asked why she didn't wear miniskirts to work. She said
it would be immodest. She was then asked her why she
took her daughters to the public pools and beaches if
she believed in modesty. She was stunned.
A teenage girl in a youth chapel session was asked why
she wore her dresses to her knees. She answered in
front of the youth group that she did so because it
was modest. She was then asked why she worked as a
lifeguard at a public pool. She had no answer.
Isn't that a double-standard on our part? In church we
want to look "holy", but outside of it........ The
Lord always sees everything. Is it right to have this
kind of double-standard, or even a lack of standards
and convictions? What does this kind of thinking say
about our love for the Lord. "If ye love me, obey my
commandments", Jesus said in John 14: 15 and 14:21.
The world has so trained us so as to not even think
what God thinks about nakedness, just like the media
has dulled our senses to violence, drugs, and other
such sins.
There is a Bible answer to what the world has done to
our thinking. It is found in Romans 12:1-2. "I beseech
youtherefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye
present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy,
acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
And be not conformed to this worldImage ut be ye
transformed by the renewing of your mind,that ye may
prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect,
will of God."

One author put it this way,"Don't let the world
squeeze you into its mold!" My, how we have gotten
away from Romans 12:1-2!
One lady said "Well, what else are my children going
to wear to the pool?" Who says they have to go to the
public pool in the first place! "Well it's hot
outside!" Ladies and gentlemen, Bible convictions are
not based on the weather or convenience! If it is in
the Bible, it does not matter what the weather is
outside.
Pastor Dan Parton was a youth pastor in the state of
MinneSNOWta for four years. It's cold up there. It is
humid up there. It is colder in the wintertime there
than you can ever imagine! The summers are sweltering.
Humidity stays at about 250%! Weather never affected
the dress standards for the youth group there. When
you learn to do things the Bible way, weather and
convenience make no difference.
What excuse do you give for your immodesty? Yes, it is
true that God looks on the heart, but man can see the
outward appearance. Abstain from the appearnce of
evil. (1 Thess 5:22). Are we not called to be a
peculiar nation (1 Pet 2:9)? Are we not to be
separate?
Immodesty was part of the "attire of an harlot"
mentioned in Proverbs 7:10, "And, behold, there met
him a woman with the attire of an harlot, and subtil
of heart."

One might say,"My friends would laugh at me and call
me strange." I'd rather be called strange by the world
than be called naked and a harlot by God! How about
you?
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Methodist Militant
Registered User
Joined: 15 Aug 2001, 04:23

28 Sep 2001, 22:31 #2

I personally think it is a sin for a woman to pray in public without a head-covering, or for a man to do with same with one. I also believe we should all dress modestly.
However, there are so many rules, that I don't know if I even want to keep them all. I feel guilty, and everytime I have some fun, I feel like I am conforming to the world. I don't know of any other way to view it. I love Jesus, but the rules make me feel like any kind of fun, humorous activity, is sinful.
Maybe, I am just a lousy Christian. I like rock music, I like to look at women, I like to flirt, I have the occasional beer, and sometimes I cuss. Either way, whether I am or not, will be determined by God. He always gets his man. We all answer to him.
Another thing, your exegetical analysis of the Bible, and your determination that we should only wear knee-length shorts, is a little over-the-top, even for an FBM'er. That is really analyzing the law, drawing paralells, and coming to a conclusion. You even went into the Old Testament, and found old Jewish laws to support your belief about it. If you truly believe in dressing modestly, then God will tell you what is permissible, and isn't, in your search to attain it. (Methodist teaching?)
I agree we should all dress modestly, but as for all the rules, and the guilt that comes with not keeping them.... I guess that is just the way it is.
Regards."...Never forget..."
Mark 16:19
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Methodist Militant
Registered User
Joined: 15 Aug 2001, 04:23

28 Sep 2001, 22:38 #3

1 Timothy
9 And I want women to be modest in their appearance. They should wear decent and appropriate clothing and not draw attention to themselves by the way they fix their hair or by wearing gold or pearls or expensive clothes. 10 For women who claim to be devoted to God should make themselves attractive by the good things they do.

I still agree with you.
Regards.
"...Never forget..."
Mark 16:19
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Kristi
Registered User
Joined: 23 Apr 1999, 07:38

28 Sep 2001, 22:49 #4

There are a few problems with this stuff.
The Holy Spirit had Paul write Romans Ch. 14 for a reason.
Secondly, some of the stuff in the Bible was written with that day's time and culture in mind.
The legalists in the Church are very selective in which things they think should be enforced and which things don't matter.
How many Christian men today follow this biblical rule/teaching:
Romans 16:16
Greet one another with a holy kiss. . .
1 Corinthians 16:20
All the brothers here send you greetings. Greet one another with a holy kiss.
2 Corinthians 13:12
Greet one another with a holy kiss.
1 Thessalonians 5:26
Greet all the brothers with a holy kiss.
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Methodist Militant
Registered User
Joined: 15 Aug 2001, 04:23

28 Sep 2001, 23:15 #5

to how good we, as Christians, should act.
"...Never forget..."
Mark 16:19
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Bill Hoyt
Registered User
Joined: 12 Sep 2001, 10:28

28 Sep 2001, 23:30 #6

Kristi, our Beloved Administrator, wrote:
"How many Christian men today follow this biblical rule/teaching...Greet one another with a holy kiss. . . "
I really hate "Me, too" posts, but I have to agree with this 100%.
oh, and you missed one ;-)
"Greet ye one another with a kiss of charity. Peace be with you all that are in Christ Jesus. Amen."-- 1 Peter 5:14
"The servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth"
-- 2Tim 2:24-25
"The servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,

In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth"


-- 2Tim 2:24-25

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Kristi
Registered User
Joined: 23 Apr 1999, 07:38

28 Sep 2001, 23:46 #7

How should we act? Holy.
But, God is a realist, and He knows that we will all stumble from time to time.
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Methodist Militant
Registered User
Joined: 15 Aug 2001, 04:23

29 Sep 2001, 02:13 #8

Does it mean keeping all the rules? How good do we have to be? What is a good definition of keeping the rules, and what is a good definition of going overboard?
Thanks,
Evan"...Never forget..."
Mark 16:19
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Methodist Militant
Registered User
Joined: 15 Aug 2001, 04:23

29 Sep 2001, 06:49 #9

I know you interpret the Bible literally. There is a lot to be said for accurate interpretation of the Bible. In fact, it is the only way. However, when one strives to interpret it too literally, you fail to see the forest for the trees.
I am a hillbilly. I mean it. Check out my profile. I'm serious about that.
If you grow up in the hills, you HAVE TO SEE THE FOREST FOR THE TREES. It is a matter of practicality. Also, you cannot see what is out there in the forest, if you are examining a piece of bark, from a tree. I have just drawn an analogy.
I commend your desire to interpret the Bible accurately. But, you have to keep in mind, that when interpreting the Scriptures, you have to take much of culture into account: Many FBM'ers just look at the words in the Bible, and fail to realize there are significant cultural differences b/t the Middle Eastern culture of 2,000-6,000 years ago, and a Middle Western culture of today. If you always neglect to understand these differences, and do not apply them to your interpretation of said Scriptures, you may not understand them accurately.
We are all for understanding the Bible. However, when interpreting them, we should strive for accuracy, and not a rigid adherence to the principle of "literal" interpretation. You do a pretty good job of being accurate. I just wanted remind you of this concept.
Now, please go over to my "homosexuality" post, and read it. Notice how Middle Western revulsion of homosexuality isn't grounded in the concept of sin. Rather it is grounded in a fear of challenges to fragile male ideas of masculinity. In the apostle Paul's time, homosexual behavior was common. It wasn't an affront to manhood. However, Paul saw it as sin, because it is sin. We should strive to see it as reprehensible in the eyes of the Trinity, because it is sin, and not vehemently object to it, because it offends our manhood.
That is just another example of how societies differ. When interpreting Scripture accurately, we have a double-whammy to deal with. A huge time difference, as well as a massive geographical difference. HOWEVER, YOU DO A VERY GOOD JOB OF INTERPRETING SCRIPTURE.
Now, go to my post on "Bible Versions," and please read it, and comment on it.
In the Trinity,
Evan"...Never forget..."
Mark 16:19
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Warrior of the Sword
Registered User
Joined: 01 May 2001, 03:50

01 Oct 2001, 17:10 #10

"Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever" (Hebrews 13:Image
"For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed." (Malachi 3:6)
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